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Chieftain of the Northern Dunedain...

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Roisin



Joined: 11 May 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2003 12:26 pm    Post subject: Chieftain of the Northern Dunedain... Reply with quote

What exactly were Aragorn's duties? Whatever they were, he didn't seem to devote a lot of time to them. He was always wandering around ME doing his own thing.

Not really fanfic-related, just a thought.

Roisin
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KhazarKhum



Joined: 02 Sep 2003
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Location: Quartz Hill, CA--USA

PostPosted: Sat Oct 04, 2003 12:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is part of the problem, isn't it? AFAIK, he has no legitimate heirs. He doesn't seem to do what the role requires. You would expect him to at least preside over something of a clan meeting, or an annual festival.

But he seems to be bound & determined to stay away from that. He is running away from his duties. That is, of course, a main theme of LOTR--Aragorn coming to grips with his destiny, and accepting it.

I'm also surprised he hasn't been married once--considering the fragility of the Numenorean bloodlines, and how critical they are, his unwillingness to marry anyone other than Arwen is strange.
Usually royal families insist on a consummated marriage as soon as the kids are old enough. History is also full of little kids getting married, and living at the court of their spouse until old enough for the marriage to be consummated.

And before anyone says Yes, he's Numenorean, but they live longer--well, keep in mind that an arrow doesn't care who your parents were. Aragorn could still be killed.
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Panneth



Joined: 10 Jun 2003
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 04, 2003 6:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had a quick skim read of the story of Aragorn and Arwen in the Appendices and basically as soon as Aragorn finally knew his heritage he fell in love with Arwen. Elrond then told him that he would have no wife until he had taken his rightful place as King because of the trials that he would have to undergo. This was when he went off into the Wild and went all over that part of M-E discovering the ways of the different people, the good and evil, including going South into I presume Harad and also fighting with the Rohan and Gondorians. During this time he met Gandalf.

I won't write the rest of this story, it's all in the book, but Aragorn was Captain of the Dunedain. We know this because there is a part in the book which describes the falling of a way into the Shire. It says something about the Dunedain being defeated by the Nazgul, but they may have held on if their Captain Aragorn had been there (someone correct me because I'm not sure that's right and I'm going on memory only Smile ) Aragorn must have taken some part in the guarding of the Shire because he was known to everyone in Bree, even if it just was marshalling his men while he went off to Mordor looking for Gollum.

Aragorn's main duty was fighting against Sauron and protecting his kingdom in Gondor. He did this by travelling throughout the region and learning all about its people and their ways so when the time came for the last push he would be better prepared. No one else knew the way from Moria to Lorien as well as he did, nor could anyone else have taken the Paths of the Dead and prevented the arrival of all those ships at the Battle of Pelennor.

Hope I've been of some help and not confused the matter further Confused
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KhazarKhum



Joined: 02 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 04, 2003 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, that's what Elrond said, but how do you suppose the Dunedain felt about it? There must have been some grumblings, and fear that they would be abandoned...or worse.
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Roisin



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PostPosted: Sat Oct 04, 2003 7:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seems like Halbarad was sort of in charge during Aragorn's extended walkabout.

Roisin
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NancyBrooke
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Joined: 11 May 2003
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 05, 2003 8:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KhazarKhum wrote:
Yes, ... but how do you suppose the Dunedain felt about it?


Now there's a plot bunny if ever I heard one! Life inside the Dunedain camp, or village, or whatever ... perhaps they were nomadic ... and how the leadership, Halbarad or whoever, felt about Aragorn being whisked away to Rivendell. Maybe it was their idea. Hmmmmmm.

Somebody write it, please!
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Roisin



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PostPosted: Sun Oct 05, 2003 8:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The whole concept of the Dunedain culture (in the North) is intriguing. Hmmm I visualize them as being sort of Celtic in character.

I wonder how they felt about being part of the Reunified Kingdom after being left more or less on their own for so long?

The other interesting thing is that Gondor seemed to have pretty much forgotten about their existence by the time of the War of the Ring.

Roisin
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miriel361



Joined: 10 Jun 2003
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2003 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What did Aragorn do? Well I think the innkeeper at Bree answers that quite nicely. Remember when Strider first appears, he refers to him as if he were someone unpleasant, someone to be avoided. But when there are no more rangers around, and the area is infiltrated with 'real' nasty types, he says something like - 'now we know what we had to thank those rangers for.'

I am misquoting but I'm sure it was something like that - when the hobbits are heading back to the Shire after the war. If you have time - look it up.
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Roisin



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PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2003 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, I know he and the other Rangers protected the Shire, I was just wondering what his leadership/ceremonial duties might have been among his own people.

Roisin
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NancyBrooke
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 8:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Roisin wrote:
I was just wondering what his leadership/ceremonial duties might have been among his own people.

Excellent question; I wish I could answer it. Isn't it curious that JRRT delves extensively into the cultures of Gondorians, Elves, Dwarves and, of course, Hobbits, but not (arguable) one his most important characters.
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Viv
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Joined: 24 Apr 2003
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2003 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NancyBrooke wrote:
Isn't it curious that JRRT delves extensively into the cultures of Gondorians, Elves, Dwarves and, of course, Hobbits, but not (arguable) one his most important characters.


Very interesting. In fact, when you look at the fellowship, JRR was pretty vague on several of them. We don't even know if Legolas had a mother (assumptions, of course, are that he did, since he seems to be a normal elf). We're not sure how old Gimli is or whether he was part of the big drama in Erebor during The Hobbit (my guess is that he's a very young dwarf, but again, that's just a guess).

At least we have some details about Aragorn (mostly in the appendix) and Frodo. And *tons* of info about Galadriel, who is, at best, a fringe character in LoTR.

This is not how I would build a story. But then, JRR is the genius, not me.
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miriel361



Joined: 10 Jun 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2003 4:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tolkien wanted to write a creation story for England, an epic that tied in all the bits and pieces that survived and re-emerged in King Arthur - hence 'The Lady of the Wood', the fair folk, the little people and my favourite - Glorfindel who I believe to be based on Lancelot ( who was raised by the Lady of the Wood) and who was described as having golden hair.

...Anyway, I guess that is why so his mind was probably on the big picture and not the details.
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Panneth



Joined: 10 Jun 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2003 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I may be wrong, but I don't think King Arthur is even that English. I think he's been adapted from a myth from Brittany in France that crossed the Channel. In truth England has no unique myths of its own, which is why Tolkien decided to write what he did.
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KhazarKhum



Joined: 02 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2003 10:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The stories that we recognize as "Arthurian" date from the 1100s, and can be traced to Chretien de Troyes, who wrote them for an audience which included Eleanor of Aquitaine. At the time she was married to Henry II of England(even though they rarely visited the island, preferring the continent.)

There were no British stories to compete with the lays being sung about Charlemagne and his Paladins; nothing like Roland or Roger. Chretien picked someone obscure from the safely-remote past, and went to town.

Tolkien was well aware of this, which is why he created his own "myth" for Britain.

Khazar, who loves Middle English literature & spent far too much time playing with it Wink
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Moralanqua



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PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2003 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Tolkien was well aware of this, which is why he created his own "myth" for Britain.


Im sure i read somewhere that Tolkien did indeed think this - but he said England and not Britain.

Dont need to remind you that Scotland, Ireland and Wales are all rich in lore which is original but at same time are part of Britain. This leads me to ponder why it was that England never formed the same intrinsic storytelling culture. Hmmm



Uzi Bunny bad bunny dies!
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