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Challenge Bunny - Polygamy in Middle Earth

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Whaddatathunk of this one challenge here?
What, you nuts?
22%
 22%  [ 2 ]
Hrmm... sounds interesting...but lemme think on it.
44%
 44%  [ 4 ]
Hell yeah!!
33%
 33%  [ 3 ]
Total Votes : 9

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LuthienTinuviel



Joined: 29 Dec 2003
Posts: 354
Location: Dancing in the clouds.

PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 6:29 am    Post subject: Challenge Bunny - Polygamy in Middle Earth Reply with quote

Just me and my overimaginative mind thanks to final exam stress. I wonder why is it that when I am the busiest and craziest that my creativity flows..

All right, I recalled this fact that there's this elf (Finwe, first wife's Miriel Serinde, second wife's Indis Confused ) from first age who had not one, but two wives. He's an oddity but heck, here's the deal;

Option 1: I challenge all of you to write a fic about elves in polygamous marriages... preferrably in Valinor... about how they cope with a large family and sharing (all right ladies, smut potential here) the hubby, the girls live together, conspire against husband, ambushin' (and not necessarily is a hackhackbadcoughcough way.

Option 2: Dwarves (yes, I'm joining Viv's bandwagon) polygamous marriages. Use your creativity... all that hair must appeal to someone..Laughing

Option 3: Hobbits... this would obviously be AU won't it...? Have fun anyways... *cheeky evil grin*

This insanity's insipired by my own cultural background plus psychology madness. Laughing Dunno whether this would be a popular concept or not... but it sure hell is different! Smile

---Challenge submitted to Challange Admins for approval...

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Eruanna



Joined: 11 Jan 2005
Posts: 426
Location: Dor-Cuarthol, betwixt the Bow and the Helm...

PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 12:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Challenge Bunny - Polygamy in Middle Earth Reply with quote

Heck, all fanfic IS silly, let's face it!!

The author Richard Adams wrote a book called "Maia" in the 1980s and it reads like a smutty version of the Silm.

It was very Tolkienian--maps, exotically named flowers, a long dramatis personae in the preface (JRRT gave us his great appendices at the end of the Silm...)

It's about an elf-like concubine named Maia in a fantasy world battling evil. I think this book is now out of print.

I have thought of (anthropology people take note) of fraternal polyandry for the brothers of Lorien. One maiden will marry three brothers. This would be likely in the case of the elves if men outnumbered the women and the birthrate (waning) was on the decline.

Or how about a male harem for Galadriel? She was Nerwen the Man-maiden. She would certainly have male appetites! LOL! Laughing Technically speaking, she has overlordship of the Noldor and is the highest elf in Middle-earth. She can do what she pleases.

Another idea, I sent this to Inglor, is the European medieval law of "the first night." This was called "jus prima nocta." (This was part of the story line in the "Braveheart" movie.) This gave the privilege of a lord to sleep with the new bride of his vassal. For a twist, I think Galadriel would fit in well with this plot line. She would have the privilege to have every new elf husband in her bed.

Now, how's that for silly plot bunnies, esp. if you read my LACE-filled recent story? Laughing ROFL

--Eruanna

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ellisk



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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 12:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Challenge Bunny - Polygamy in Middle Earth Reply with quote

Eruanna wrote:
Another idea, I sent this to Inglor, is the European medieval law of "the first night." This was called "jus prima nocta." (This was part of the story line in the "Braveheart" movie.) This gave the privilege of a lord to sleep with the new bride of his vassal. For a twist, I think Galadriel would fit in well with this plot line. She would have the privilege to have every new elf husband in her bed.
--Eruanna


First Night is a fun concept to play with and has a lot of erotic potential indeed. But as a medieval scholar I cannot resist but point out that there is no historical basis for the 'First Night' tradition in the 'medieval world' as seen in modern literature/movies. There is not even any literary basis for it in European Medieval lit. It was probably popularized in the 1800's and may have been practiced in pagan societies as a 'fertility rite.' The most famous lit example of it is seen in Gilgamesh (approx 1900 BC) and it was referenced by Voltaire, who condemned its use as a literary device in The Marriage of Figaro. In real life, however, medieval european man would have been horrified at the idea at many levels.

Sorry. I fall back into school-mode sometimes. Confused

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Last edited by ellisk on Sun Mar 06, 2005 12:40 pm; edited 2 times in total
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SpaceWeavil



Joined: 27 May 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The idea of the dwarves possibly having a harem or some sort of polygamy going on I could cope with. It would almost be worth doing the story just to get Gimli some action (A really wicked part of me is thinking of the Movie! verse 'competition' between Legolas and Gimli that went on throughout, only instead of counting up kills...)

I can't really bring myself to think of polygamy in elvendom though. I'm a bit too LACE-orientated, I suppose, but there's an article in Morgoth's Ring on Miriel and Finwe and the weird contrivances that Finwe's second marriage produced, and why such things just weren't done (since the marriage was supposed to be of the fea, as well as the hroa, there was a presumption that the marriage would resume when the couple were reunited in Aman, even if one was slain before the other).

There was something about anullment of the marriage, if it were mutual, though I must admit I can't recall the details off hand, and I'm supposed to be studying stipulatio ex die at the moment so don't have HoME to hand. But maybe that would give a few plot bunnies? It would be an interesting 'family' situation to look at - I mean two elves who both decide not to be married any more. Something really rotten would have to happen to make them feel that way, I would reckon, and even if they did reach an agreement and decided to end the marriage, possibly to remarry, then what would happen if there were children involved?

I actually think a story adhering to canon could still be really interesting, since such a thing would be so unheard of. What would their friends' reactions be as well?

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Eruanna



Joined: 11 Jan 2005
Posts: 426
Location: Dor-Cuarthol, betwixt the Bow and the Helm...

PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 12:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Challenge Bunny - Polygamy in Middle Earth Reply with quote

ellisk wrote:
Eruanna wrote:
Another idea, I sent this to Inglor, is the European medieval law of "the first night." This was called "jus prima nocta." (This was part of the story line in the "Braveheart" movie.) This gave the privilege of a lord to sleep with the new bride of his vassal. For a twist, I think Galadriel would fit in well with this plot line. She would have the privilege to have every new elf husband in her bed.
--Eruanna


First Night is a fun concept to play with and has a lot of erotic potential indeed. But as a medieval scholar I cannot resist but point out that there is no historical basis for the 'First Night' tradition seen in modern literature. There is not even any literary basis for it in Medieval lit. It was invented in the 1800's. Medieval man would have been horrified at the idea at many levels.

Sorry. I fall back into school-mode sometimes. Confused


Ellisk:

Thank you for setting my facts straight! I love learning REAL from fiction. History is very revisionist in many ways. Big Hug

Still, it is a delicious plot bunny! Wink

On the other hand, did not the Roman empress Valeria Messalina challenge a courtesan to see how many men each woman could take on? Legend has it that they used the Praetorian guard for bedmates! LOL!

--Eruanna

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ellisk



Joined: 23 Jan 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 12:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Challenge Bunny - Polygamy in Middle Earth Reply with quote

Not a correction, just a comment. I editted that post actually to make it a little more specific because what I originally said was not entirely correct either due to lack of specifics.

Eruanna wrote:
[On the other hand, did not the Roman empress Valeria Messalina challenge a courtesan to see how many men each woman could take on? Legend has it that they used the Praetorian guard for bedmates! LOL!

--Eruanna


Oh now if we want to go back to Roman times, I can get much worse than that little story.

I remember reading research that cites sources that described early Roman chieftains that did practice the right of First Night. When their populations grew so large that they could no longer keep up with their duties, the marriage ceremony evolved to include the bride publicly lowering herself on an anatomically correct (and erect) stature of the local fertility god to prove her virginity, relieve her husband of the need of coming into contact with blood and to ensure the fertility of their marriage. Supposedly there was written evidence of that but I never personally checked the sources cited. Didn't really want to--yuck! Shocked

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Eruanna



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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 12:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Challenge Bunny - Polygamy in Middle Earth Reply with quote

Quote:
I remember reading research that cites sources that described early Roman chieftains that did practice the right of First Night. When their populations grew so large that they could no longer keep up with their duties, the marriage ceremony evolved to include the bride publicly lowering herself on an anatomically correct (and erect) stature of the local fertility god to prove her virginity, relieve her husband of the need of coming into contact with blood and to ensure the fertility of their marriage. Supposedly there was written evidence of that but I never personally checked the sources cited.


I think the novel "Maia" had something like that, but not related to marriage customs, just fertility rituals.

I am also a bit too into LACE! I imagine a plot bunny where Erkenbrand encourages the elves (Haldir or, say, Elrond or Legolas, the nobility) to keep a concubine. Imagine the debate that ensues!

Concubinage was known in medieval Europe. Ellisk? Your thoughts?

--Eruanna

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Elentari



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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My wretched self has espasms just thinking about polyandry...

heck! What are we waiting for?
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LuthienTinuviel



Joined: 29 Dec 2003
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 8:43 pm    Post subject: Re: Challenge Bunny - Polygamy in Middle Earth Reply with quote

ellisk wrote:

I remember reading research that cites sources that described early Roman chieftains that did practice the right of First Night. When their populations grew so large that they could no longer keep up with their duties, the marriage ceremony evolved to include the bride publicly lowering herself on an anatomically correct (and erect) stature of the local fertility god to prove her virginity, relieve her husband of the need of coming into contact with blood and to ensure the fertility of their marriage. Supposedly there was written evidence of that but I never personally checked the sources cited. Didn't really want to--yuck! Shocked


No kidding! Shocked Not to mention plain embarassing and painful!

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