[Alassante]

I have been pondering lately...some aloud to others...some to my dog who always agrees with me...does the Silmarillion fiction get the attention it used to? Or did it ever? I say this because I have recently started dabbling in it...well, mainly drabbling in it and the hit counts don't even begin to compare to the LOTR fictions I have written. I've tried not to take it personally and looked around at other people's stories in the Silm section and see alot of the same thing. Now I know that Curufin or Maeglin will never be as popular as say Haldir, Eomer, or Legolas, but is it mainly the casual visitors that are not really reviewing any fiction that is driving the hit counts up on the LOTR stuff and 'they' don't like Silmarillion fiction or is it just a huge number of people have no interest in it what-so-ever? Is it big on other sites? I find it rather odd because when I came to OSA I always heard "Read the Silmarillion!". So...I read, I wrote...now what?

[Sulriel]

I'm much more a fan of the Silm than I am of LotR, but I think what you're seeing is a simple trickle-down. Not as many people have read it, and there isn't a movie, so I think, by default, it's less popular.

fanfic by it's definition, is stories about characters that the readers already know and love, or characters in a known world. I think the Silm characters, the events, and the world to some extent, are unfamiliar to a lot of LotR readers/movie-goers.

I enjoy Silm-fic and bemoan the lack of it, but I run into a couple of problems when I'm reading. Mainly that I have such strongly developed ideas and ideals of the characters already in my head, it's *very* hard for an author to connect with me with a canon character. I know that's not 'right', and not 'fair' to the author, but it's simply the truth.

When I first started reading fanfic, I found so much of the Silmfic to be elf-slash that I tended to stay away from it for awhile, but of course, that isn't a problem here.

I write Silm characters, either in the 1st age or the 4th age and have never had a lot of hits or reader/reviews, but I've never written a 3rd Age or LotR fic, so I can't compare. My non-fiction tends to do well, but many of those hits are from gamers and other markets outside the fandom.

Sulriel

[NancyBrooke]

[Alassante]

But Nancy one thing, alot of the stories retell an event in laymans terms. Like my drabbles that you read, they were retelling little snippets of the story of Feanor and his sons. So there are times where the fiction will actually tell you the story in a way that will tempt you to read more.

To all of you that have TRIED to read the Silmarillion but simply cannot get far in it, once you past the beginning, the Ainulindalë and Valaquenta, it does get easier. I gave up soooo many times trying to read the Ainulindalë. But once I got into the Quenta Silmarillion and the elves awoke, I was hooked. And there are men as well for all of you PMF. The Age of the Trees and the First Age men and elves have an edge to them that is intriguing. Seriously! If you think Legolas and Haldir is hawt, try reading about Finrod or Beleg. And the House of Finwe? Totally fascinating elves! Fingolfin, Feanor, Fingon, Maedhros, Maglor, Caranthir, Turgon, Celegom, Curufin (my personal fave) just to name a few - are totally fascinating. Of course there is Thingol who fell in love with Melian, a maia. They were parents to Luthien.

For you PMF, read about Beren, the love of Luthien. If you like Aragorn, you'll love Beren! Then there is Tuor and Eärendil. And Nancy, you'll love the Akallabêth - the history of the Downfall of Númenor in the Second Age.

Anyway, thats my little advertisement for Silmarillion. Hehe. If I can read and absorb it - anyone can!! There are still some parts of it that haven't stuck with me like other parts.

[ghettoelleth]

Of course, there's always the abridged version. I can send you that Nancy if you wanna get ghetto fabbuhluss. I haven't quite made it to Hurin, Turin, Durin, and Urine yet though. I'm still stuck back at the swarthy dudes, Ulfang, Ulfast, Uldor and Ulworth, Bor, Borlad, Borlach, Borthand, Borax, Boredom, Huey, Dewey and Luey. But hehe, those Fins are a son of a b*&(&h.

[vladazhael]

i think the appeal of the silmarillion is limited, at least for many people, by its complexity. it's not just a story; there's an entire world behind it, full of very specific landscapes, a list of characters that in length rivals that of the bible, several unique languages, and a twisting and multifaceted narrative structure. all the appendices and family trees and glossaries are there for very good reason, and i suspect that even the most dedicated fans still have to turn quickly to that section in the middle of a sentence. (lord knows i have - in the middle of a lunch break in a public softly muttering, "who the hell was that guy?" to myself. ) and not everybody is prepared for that kind of involvement - i've heard far more people say "i tried" than "i read it." so the whole thing is surrounded by an aura of intimidation, and anything related to it is subject to the same reflexive caution, even if it would otherwise provide more easily accessible enlightenment.

of course, there are also those of us hyperfocusing freaks who picked it up and had a roaring joygasm at the possibility of history, geography, linguistics, and drama all in the same place. frankly, i haven't been able to bring myself to stop carrying the book around in my purse since i finished it, and i still don't have all the details straight in my head. which i don't think proves anything, other than my continued need for serious mental help...

anyway, what was i babbling about? oh, right. the silmarillion. it's always going to have a selective audience, not the huge - and often fickle - following of lotr. it's the difference between playing to a stadium full of mixed levels of interest and playing to a small club full of dedicated followers. of course, neither is inherently better than the other, just a matter of perspective.

some of that, i think, may have made sense in the translation from my brain to the keyboard.

[ghettoelleth]

On a serious note, hmmph, imagine that, I think it has to do more with what breed of fancier you are. While it is true that humans in general play a major role in the Silmarillion, every stand out tale of every Man, Turin, Beren, Huor, Tuor, etc. is told to advance the tale of the Elves. There are no adventures embarked upon solely by men with the outcome impacting men alone. For the writer, there simply is not alot to build upon about men that is independant of the Eldar. There are no hobbits for the phf, no dwarves for the pdf except for that dick Dopey or Sleepy, can't remember his name...Grumpy, that was it. No horselords, wizards or ethereal and well grounded elves even, for that matter. Even the Elves, in contrast to those of the third age are a rather primitive and savage lot. I know that for me its difficult to get into UT because the opposite is true. Also, if one is not a PEF, there is no direct connection between any transient race, unlike with the elves who are, for all intents and purposes, interminable. Cirdan, Celeborn, Elrond, Galadriel, they all are firmly rooted in the first age as much as they are in the third which, IMHO, makes the Sil more intriguing for us PEFs. I don't think that complexity would be a big deterrant if, for example, Duchess gave a flying tit about the elves. Excuse my use and abuse, Duchess. Al struggled like hell, she really worked her butt of to read the Sil. Ask her whether it was Ulfang's tribe or Bor's tribe that betrayed Caranthir...on the other hand, ask her what color underwear Curufin was wearing at Losgar during the burning of the ships and I guarantee she can tell you, lol.

Just my take on why Sil is less widely popular than LoTR. Narrower scope, narrower following.

[Alassante]

Ulfang I think and he goes commando. Curufin not Ulfang.

I did okay with names of people but Tolkien named every blade of grass, drop of water, and event in M.E. with three names minimum so I cannot keep up with those! Himlad, Himring, Himloth - its insane.

[SilverMoonLady]

Well, I've read the Silmarillion several times (finally a use for my anthro training!) and found it wonderfully rich; complex, a bit confusing at times, but fascinating - and truth be told, if I were ever to write proper elf-fic, it would likely be 1st Age.
On the other hand, I do understand how someone coming off the classic narrative form of LotR (not to mention the movie) might find it a challenge to read something like this.
Well, at least you know your readers have at least half a brain, having been able to read and appreciate the original work!

[Rhapsody]

[Anna]

I used to be one of those who had tried to read the Sil, but now I´m hooked! Gotta love those First Age Wonder Elfsies....

Anyway, I agree with Alassante about the Ainulindalë and Valaquenta. Gah, it was sooo frustrating trying to get past the beginning!

The first time I read the Sil it left me rather confused (all the names and places) and it felt more like something I had to do. I can´t say I enjoyed it, really.
But, we had a reading group here on OSA ages ago which helped me a lot. We read the Sil together and then discussed it, which was so much fun. We didn´t finish it together, though, for different reasons.
Because of the reading group and our discussions I found the motivation to tackle UT, HoME and so on, which has made me a happier person!

So....reading the Sil (which ultimately leads to reading Sil fanfics) makes you a happier person with a more contented look upon life!

[RobinKa]

My first reading of the Silm (a Polish edition) left me confused and wondering if Tolkien knew only one letter in the entire alphabet, namely the letter f but I was fascinated at the same time and wanted more, so I re-read it, and re-read it, and re-read it... Of course I had a *gasp, oh no* moment, while reading the tale of Turin, and the scene of Beleg's death.
The first attempt to read it in English was tough because I had to open a dictionary and my Polish Silm edition, and in the end I was so proud of myself that I managed to read it I still wanted more so I read UT and HoME, and I can say that to read the Silm was a piece of cake in comparison to reading "The Lays of Beleriand". But if you love something, nothing is gonna stop you, right? (Does it make me sound like one of the Feanorians? ).

[Alassante]

Binka - I am currently reading the The Lay of Beleriand (off and on) and you're right, its tough. But its amazing that he wrote that. I mean I struggled writing a 300 word drabble in rhyming poem style. And The Lay is truly beautiful.

See Ghetto! I did know it was Ulfang. *gloats* And I remember that I missed that on that Silm quiz here because I knew Caranthir had been betrayed and I thought Caranthir killed him not Maglor. Oh well - Caranthir SHOULD have killed him. LOL