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sindohte

Joined: 13 May 2003 Posts: 1621 Location: Rubbing up against an Elf
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 1:44 am Post subject: Serious Fic vs. Smut |
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Just some late night musing that I wanted to share. OSA is geared to be an archive that accepts het fanfic rated from G to NC-17. What I am curious to know from everyone is - when you are trying to decide what story to read, do you try to find something that will appeal to your head or something that will appeal to your crotch?
I enjoy reading smut stories due in part to the subject matter, but also because I can read one of them in ten minutes and be done with it. Yet I also like reading longer stories that are more character driven and where sex, even if it does occur, is not the raison d'etre of the story. It gives me the chance to connect with the characters on a deeper level. These non-smut stories require more of a time investment because they tend to be multi-chaptered vs. the typical single chapter length of a PWP.
So what factors motivate your reading choices here at OSA?
And let me be blatantly honest, I am trying to prove the point that there is a contingent of people at OSA who are interested in non-smut. _________________ abandon thought, and let the dream descend... |
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Vulgarweed
Joined: 13 Feb 2004 Posts: 31 Location: The Sickly Crescent (Best Tavern in the Morgul Vale)
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 2:52 am Post subject: |
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Well, I tend to choose using both my head and my crotch -- they aren't quite as separate as maybe they should be.
Seriously, I love all sorts of stories, explicit and not. But I think smut should also be character-driven. It shouldn't always be something you can read in ten minutes. It certainly shouldn't be something where you can switch any old names and have it still work. Good smut should reveal as much about the characters in how they have sex as in how they fight battles or have conversations--it is NOT all the same all the time between all people, I can assure you.
Sex does after all have buildup, climax, and resolution, as we learn about in Creative Writing 101. Often there is conflict too. Often it must be negotiated. There can be power struggles, serious or playful. There can be many deeper issues coming into play. And there's the whole issue of the relationship-- is it eternal love, casual, friends-with-benefits, on a dare, in the heat of the moment, longed-for, just business, anonymous, even antagonistic? Does it mean the same thing to both people involved, or is there an imbalance or a misunderstanding? Is there curiosity, fear, hope? Does wartime factor in? Cultural differences? Radical differences in experience levels? Technical difficulties? Good smut works multiple threads like this in and keeps them true while still being hot.
I like gen and other non-smut just fine. But I disagree strongly with the equation of "smut" with brainlessness, and it seems all too common to me.
Also, I disagree with the equation of length with depth (Get your mind out of the gutter, I mean in PROSE. ). I've read many short things that haunted me for months and still do, that I'm still thinking about, and many long things that I thought were basically just soap operas. And of course there are great long things and superficial short ones too, but form is, after all, only form, and a story should just be exactly as long as it needs to be. |
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Ania

Joined: 08 Sep 2003 Posts: 198 Location: Britain
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 5:02 am Post subject: |
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I generally prefer to stick with more serious fics, but ones that I particularly enjoy are ones that have the smut written into into wih a particular significance for the characters, and a realistic development. Saying that, some smut is really good to read if it is written well and the characters are well developed, if they're slightly naughtier I occassionally find it amusing , but I normally prefer a longer fic with a well-developed storyline and characters. |
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BittenBuggy

Joined: 27 Dec 2003 Posts: 2108 Location: Busy Being the Queen Of Everything.. And Trying to Catch the Yoda-Copter
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 5:39 am Post subject: |
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Regardless of what the rest of the OSA population believes, I do read stuff other than smut
I have read several long novel-lengths (My favoriate still be 'The Bond' by Maira...) where yes, there is smut, but it is far and few between.
It depends on what kind of mood I'm in really and how much time I have. If I can sit down at the computer and read for 4 hours, then I will read a longer story. I can't start reading, and then stop! I can't do it, I have to finish. Which is why ZeeDrippyVessel's 'Empty Vessel' almost did me in at 450 some odd pages.
Weed *cackles because she gets to say 'weed'* I totally agree with you, smut shouldn't be 'mindless.' Not good smut anyway!
I shall return with more comments!  _________________ -The Queen of Everything - so dubed by Aerin
-"My ultimate fantasy is to entice a man to my bedroom, put a gun to his head and say, 'Make babies or die'."
-"The Pope! how many divisions has he got?" - Stalin |
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sindohte

Joined: 13 May 2003 Posts: 1621 Location: Rubbing up against an Elf
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 5:45 am Post subject: |
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| Vulgarweed wrote: | | But I think smut should also be character-driven. It shouldn't always be something you can read in ten minutes. It certainly shouldn't be something where you can switch any old names and have it still work. Good smut should reveal as much about the characters in how they have sex as in how they fight battles or have conversations--it is NOT all the same all the time between all people, I can assure you. |
You have hit the nail upon the head. I totally agree with that. And that is the difference between something that is sensual and something that is just sex. And while a story that is just about sex may be good, a story that is sensual will have you coming back to read it again and again and again.
| Quote: | | Sex does after all have buildup, climax, and resolution, as we learn about in Creative Writing 101. Often there is conflict too. Often it must be negotiated. There can be power struggles, serious or playful. There can be many deeper issues coming into play. And there's the whole issue of the relationship-- is it eternal love, casual, friends-with-benefits, on a dare, in the heat of the moment, longed-for, just business, anonymous, even antagonistic? Does it mean the same thing to both people involved, or is there an imbalance or a misunderstanding? Is there curiosity, fear, hope? Does wartime factor in? Cultural differences? Radical differences in experience levels? Technical difficulties? Good smut works multiple threads like this in and keeps them true while still being hot. |
Oooo, you are speaking to the psych major in me - "deeper issues." For me that is the life's blood of a story. And it turns a piece of writing from just a "story" to a "STORY."
| Quote: | | I like gen and other non-smut just fine. But I disagree strongly with the equation of "smut" with brainlessness, and it seems all too common to me. |
Here is another curiosity question for me, when an author sits down to write smut, do they consciously or unconsciously decide to appeal to the reader's head or to their crotch? For me personally, I want to grab both of them hard and not let go And that is why it takes me time to write smut (much to BB's consternation ). It doesn't take long for my gutter dragging mind to come up with an idea for a sex scene, but it takes longer to figure out the psychological side of things.
Also, I disagree with the equation of length with depth (Get your mind out of the gutter, I mean in PROSE. ). [/quote]
True. I just came up with an artifical distinction to get things started. So based on what has been discussed so far, it looks like that when it comes to non-smut vs. smut, there are the following categories.
prose - brevity with depth
prose - brevity without depth
prose - length with depth
prose - lenth without depth
smut - sex without depth
smut - sensual with depth _________________ abandon thought, and let the dream descend... |
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BittenBuggy

Joined: 27 Dec 2003 Posts: 2108 Location: Busy Being the Queen Of Everything.. And Trying to Catch the Yoda-Copter
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 5:48 am Post subject: |
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| sindohte wrote: | And that is why it takes me time to write smut (much to BB's consternation ). |
You're just using that as an excuse to write slow and deprive me of smut! You fiend.  _________________ -The Queen of Everything - so dubed by Aerin
-"My ultimate fantasy is to entice a man to my bedroom, put a gun to his head and say, 'Make babies or die'."
-"The Pope! how many divisions has he got?" - Stalin |
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sindohte

Joined: 13 May 2003 Posts: 1621 Location: Rubbing up against an Elf
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 5:49 am Post subject: |
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| BittenBuggy wrote: | | It depends on what kind of mood I'm in really and how much time I have. If I can sit down at the computer and read for 4 hours, then I will read a longer story. |
Time definitely plays a factor for me as well. I save my reading of longer stories for the weekend, because I hate being forced to stop a longer story. But I am a fast reader so during the week, I can whip through a shorter 7-chapter non-smut story in about an hour or less if I find one that catches my fancy and there are not too many interruptions. However smut is a speed reader's friend. _________________ abandon thought, and let the dream descend...
Last edited by sindohte on Fri May 14, 2004 6:03 am; edited 1 time in total |
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sindohte

Joined: 13 May 2003 Posts: 1621 Location: Rubbing up against an Elf
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 5:58 am Post subject: |
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| BittenBuggy wrote: | | sindohte wrote: | And that is why it takes me time to write smut (much to BB's consternation ). |
You're just using that as an excuse to write slow and deprive me of smut! You fiend.  |
No dearest. I am writing slowly because I have been doing lots of research about BDSM You do want my story to be perfectly accurate do you not? Another reason that I am being so slow with the writing is that I want to be able to accurately write about the psychological impact and all of the delicious intrapsychic conflict that will arise when my character finds herself doing things she finds enjoyable, yet challenges her view of who she thought she was as a person. So it is deeper questions like that which interfere with me just dishing out the smut. That is why writing is like an in-depth psychoanalytic encounter for me. _________________ abandon thought, and let the dream descend... |
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BittenBuggy

Joined: 27 Dec 2003 Posts: 2108 Location: Busy Being the Queen Of Everything.. And Trying to Catch the Yoda-Copter
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 2:16 pm Post subject: |
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 _________________ -The Queen of Everything - so dubed by Aerin
-"My ultimate fantasy is to entice a man to my bedroom, put a gun to his head and say, 'Make babies or die'."
-"The Pope! how many divisions has he got?" - Stalin |
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Andreth
Joined: 24 Oct 2003 Posts: 1211
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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When my aunt was trying to talk me into reading her romance novels she equated smut stories with Twinkies. She said they're like junk food for the mind and fun to indulge in at times, but after a while you start getting hungry for something more substantial.
I enjoy smut stories, but a total diet of them would get very old after a while. I more enjoy the stories that bring you into the characters' lives and lets you get to know them before being introduced to their sex lives. It just adds an entirely different dimension to the smut for me and makes it more enjoyable to read.
I like most stories, smut centered or no smut at all, that are thought provocative and written well. But I REALLY enjoy a story that is well written, thought provocative, AND is laced with smut here and there where applicable to the storyline. Anything that draws you deeper into the characters' lives and furthers the storyline is a good thing when used properly.
Anna |
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sindohte

Joined: 13 May 2003 Posts: 1621 Location: Rubbing up against an Elf
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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To put it in really simple terms BB gun, I want my character to figure out if the fact that she likes down and dirty sex is wrong. _________________ abandon thought, and let the dream descend... |
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Andreth
Joined: 24 Oct 2003 Posts: 1211
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 2:29 pm Post subject: |
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| BittenBuggy wrote: |  |
It's okay, BB. Find a happy place. Focus on the bunny. Calm thoughts and deep breaths. It'll be all right.
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sindohte

Joined: 13 May 2003 Posts: 1621 Location: Rubbing up against an Elf
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 2:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Andreth wrote: | When my aunt was trying to talk me into reading her romance novels she equated smut stories with Twinkies. She said they're like junk food for the mind and fun to indulge in at times, but after a while you start getting hungry for something more substantial.
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So if smut stories such as romance novels are Twinkies (I personally call it getting my crack fix), then what would you call a story whose primary focus is not smut? Prime rib with garlic whipped mashed potatoes? Man, it is about time to get my butt to the nearest steakhouse for some real food. _________________ abandon thought, and let the dream descend... |
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sindohte

Joined: 13 May 2003 Posts: 1621 Location: Rubbing up against an Elf
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 2:33 pm Post subject: |
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| BittenBuggy wrote: |  |
I am truly sorry that I use so many big words at times, but I actually spent one summer reading the entire dictionary from beginning to end as a kid.  _________________ abandon thought, and let the dream descend... |
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BittenBuggy

Joined: 27 Dec 2003 Posts: 2108 Location: Busy Being the Queen Of Everything.. And Trying to Catch the Yoda-Copter
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Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 2:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Andreth wrote: | | BittenBuggy wrote: |  |
It's okay, BB. Find a happy place. Focus on the bunny. Calm thoughts and deep breaths. It'll be all right.
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The bunny... yes... the bunny...
I am convined you two are trying to do me in  _________________ -The Queen of Everything - so dubed by Aerin
-"My ultimate fantasy is to entice a man to my bedroom, put a gun to his head and say, 'Make babies or die'."
-"The Pope! how many divisions has he got?" - Stalin |
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