Login

Lost Password?

Create New Account

A few questions from a newly obsessed reader.

Goto page 1, 2  Next

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Silvae



Joined: 28 Nov 2004
Posts: 99
Location: Lyon, France

PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 4:16 pm    Post subject: A few questions from a newly obsessed reader. Reply with quote

Hi there everyone!! I'm new here, having only recently discovered how cool LotR is, and I have a few questions about passages in the book, which I am hoping other, more knowledgable fans can answer (lol) BlahBlah . For a start :
- When Gandalf, Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli arive at Meduseld in book II, Gandalf teels Theoden "Seldom has any lord of Rohan recieved three such guests". Obviously he's referring to Aragorn and himself, but who's the third? If it's Legolas, why did he just introduce him as "Legolas the Elf" at the door? He doesn't seem that well known, or important, for that matter, in the way Men treat him. If he's talking about Gimli, does he have royal blood (I haven't read the appendices)?
- Elrond is called Halfelven, and yet he's immortal. Is the name true, which would imply he's mortal (unless the elven gene is the "predominant" one Rolling Eyes )? Or has it just got some obscure origin that hasn't got anything to do with his life-span?
-Who, or what, is Tom Bombadil, in your opinion?
Thanks a lot for all answers,
Clara
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Yavanie



Joined: 02 Jun 2004
Posts: 630
Location: Texas

PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welcome! you have certainly come to the right place to explore your obsession with LOTR. I suggest you check out the Forum and explore what's in The Lirbrary and The Books discussions. If that doesn't answer your questions before the knowlege wizards here respond, then it will at least entertain you until they do! From France? Then if English is not your first language have no fear, this is a very good place for those fortunate enough to speak more than one language, even if it isn't elf!

Again, welcome to the nuthouse!

_________________
Yavanie

...I understand the sadness of the Elves, and I have seen Mordor.

To be older and wiser you must first be younger and stupider.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Hathor



Joined: 09 Jun 2003
Posts: 346
Location: Lancashire, England

PostPosted: Sun Nov 28, 2004 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When he says "guests such as these" I think he's returning to weirdness of it all. I mean, an Elf AND a Man AND a Dwarf? At the same time? Gadzooks! Or something equally odd. Have you tried reading the Appendices? They're good for this kind of information.

Ah, the Halfelven... to try and condense the Silmarillion, Elrond's Dad was human. Elrond's Mum was an Elf. (This is a generalisation. His family tree is even more odd than this, but the Elrond fans can explain it better than me) Elrond is a Half-Elf. Elrond also had a twin by the name of Elros. The two were given a choice; stay as Elves or become human. Elrond chose Elves and Elros chose humanity. Elros went onto found Numenour. He's a very very very very very distant ancestor to Aragorn!

All horrible generalisations, I'm afraid. I can't recommend The SIlmarillion enough; it's a fabulous story and has the backstory to a lot of characters and places.

Have fun here!

_________________
~Hathor~

Owner of 'Just Another Hole' and Lindir, The Pretty Noldo Totty

Postatem obscuri lateris nescitis...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Akroma



Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Posts: 17
Location: Portugal

PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
His family tree is even more odd than this


Laughing Laughing
That is a massive understatement!
Elrond's dad's dad was mortal, and he's one of the best mortal characters in Tolkien..
Actually, you can trace almost everything into Elrond's bloodline.. let's see...

Noldor.. Vanyar.. Sindar.. Telerin.. Maiar.. Three houses of Men.. Heck! All he needs is a bit of Valar and then... Razz

Tom bombadil, in my opinion, is a Maia, like Gandalf.
He's been around since forever, and he's probably one of the bunch of maiar that stayed in arda after the making of valinor, like Melian.. the thing is that he remained there untill the fourth age and beyond, who knows..

_________________
Ah.. Quenestil.... Beats Legolas any day...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
NancyBrooke
Challenge Admin


Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 160
Location: In a motel 6 by the airport

PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree that Gandalf means Aragorn, Gimli and Legolas. Not only Man, Dwarf, and Elf; each is heir to a great house, AND they have accomplished amazing things as part of the Fellowship not to mention running half-way across Middle Earth after Merry and Pippin.
_________________
NB Duchess of WHY TF Cant'chu Punctuate, First Duchess of F*&(ing &*ll yur comma placement sux!
Nazgul #3 in charge of ducking & sniggering

Garo golf a conu ned i eneth aran an ir ho delitha ad
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Thuriniel



Joined: 29 Jul 2003
Posts: 665
Location: Watching the purple sky fly over me ...

PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well ... about Legolas ... we don't really know that he's the heir (and the more I read, the less likely I think he's the oldest) ... but he's definitely a prince.

I personally think it refers to the oddity of having a human, a dwarf, and an elf together. It sort of refers back to Eomer's reaction when he encounters them in the plains of Rohan.

_________________
~ boe an phân pedi ‘lam dadui ~ Reading
~ everyone should speak a second language ~
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
NancyBrooke
Challenge Admin


Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 160
Location: In a motel 6 by the airport

PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thuriniel wrote:
Well ... about Legolas ... we don't really know that he's the heir (and the more I read, the less likely I think he's the oldest) ... but he's definitely a prince.

I stand corrected. You'd think I'd know by now never to opine on Elven matters! Laughing

_________________
NB Duchess of WHY TF Cant'chu Punctuate, First Duchess of F*&(ing &*ll yur comma placement sux!
Nazgul #3 in charge of ducking & sniggering

Garo golf a conu ned i eneth aran an ir ho delitha ad
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
inglor



Joined: 26 Apr 2004
Posts: 853
Location: Not here, not there, not anywhere

PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Re Tom: people have died over that argument, no one is quite sure. There is a reference to his origins in His Letters but I can't quote it, I THINK the Prof said he was an earth spirit, not a maia or a vala, something entirely different. There are numerous threads on numerous sites refering to Tom's origins.

Here is Elronds heritage, you make up your own mind.

Elrod's Father:

Idril (elf) = Tuor (man)> Earendil

Earendil= Elwing > Elrond

Elrond's Mother:

Melian (Maia) = Thingol (Elf)> Luthien

Luthien = Beren (Man) > Dior

Dior = Nimloth (elf) > Elwing

So actually, Half Elven is not really correct either, from a strictly biological sense.

Inlgor

_________________
Hi, My name is Inglor and I am a Tolkien Geek (sub-species: Silgeek)

Owner of the phrase: "merciless attention" so authorized by Viv
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Viv
Challenge Admin


Joined: 24 Apr 2003
Posts: 71
Location: Texas

PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 5:16 pm    Post subject: Re: A few questions from a newly obsessed reader. Reply with quote

Silvae wrote:
If he's talking about Gimli, does he have royal blood (I haven't read the appendices)?


Although I agree with the previous posters who said the quote probably implied that it was weird to have all three races assembled in one place, and in Rohan at that, I can't resist the opportunity to chatter about Gimli. Smile

Gimli's grandfather was the younger son of King Nain II. His father was Gloin, one of Thorin Oakenshield's company in The Hobbit. Through his great-grandfather, Gimli can claim direct descent from Durin the Deathless, which means that he is a member of the principal house of dwarves. So, yep, he's a pretty important dwarf. Cool
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
Thuriniel



Joined: 29 Jul 2003
Posts: 665
Location: Watching the purple sky fly over me ...

PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 5:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NancyBrooke wrote:
Thuriniel wrote:
Well ... about Legolas ... we don't really know that he's the heir (and the more I read, the less likely I think he's the oldest) ... but he's definitely a prince.

I stand corrected. You'd think I'd know by now never to opine on Elven matters! Laughing


Sometimes I blush when I think how much I've read about Legolas Laughing .

One could argue that since Legolas is the only son of Thranduil ever mentioned in Tolkien's works, then he's the only offspring and heir to the throne.

The truth is that we really don't know the definite answers and we're only speculating ...

... so don't feel bad Wink .

Besides, I know nothing about the world of Men Very Happy !

_________________
~ boe an phân pedi ‘lam dadui ~ Reading
~ everyone should speak a second language ~
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Silvae



Joined: 28 Nov 2004
Posts: 99
Location: Lyon, France

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi!! I'm back again! (And have read up a bit since last time, too!) This time, my question is about naming in Rohan (ha!) - We've got
Thengel (+Morwen of Lossarnach)
Theodwyn+ Eo(d?)mund and Theoden (+???? that's question n°1)and non-identified other sis.
Eowyn and Eomer, cousins to Theodred.
From this much :
Are girls' names a mishmash of both parents' names?
Are boys' names a part of the father's + a traditional kind of ending (und, ed, er, el...)
Help!!! needed here, my fic is sounding very weird at the moment! What do you think?

_________________
For what be a wanderer that wandereth not?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
SpaceWeavil



Joined: 27 May 2004
Posts: 23
Location: Looking at shiny things

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Silvae wrote:
Hi!! I'm back again! (And have read up a bit since last time, too!) This time, my question is about naming in Rohan (ha!) - We've got
Thengel (+Morwen of Lossarnach)
Theodwyn+ Eo(d?)mund and Theoden (+???? that's question n°1)and non-identified other sis.
Eowyn and Eomer, cousins to Theodred.
From this much :
Are girls' names a mishmash of both parents' names?
Are boys' names a part of the father's + a traditional kind of ending (und, ed, er, el...)
Help!!! needed here, my fic is sounding very weird at the moment! What do you think?


If it's of any use, I have a Microsoft Word file of an Anglo-Saxon to Modern English wordlist. Might give you some words to use as names for Rohan? (That's what I use it for). If you want, I can email it.

_________________
Pervy Nazgul Fancier and owner of Fluffy the Fell Beast
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address
Elandriel



Joined: 18 Jan 2005
Posts: 6
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I’m not entirely sure what to make of it, but I would assume that the third he’s referring to is Legolas. Legolas is the only son (that we know of) of King Thranduil, but it is strange that throughout the books he is only once referred to as a prince and no mentions are made of his royal blood. He is referred to as ‘Legolas of the Woodland Realm’, ‘Legolas the Elf’ ‘Legolas, an elf from the north’ and ‘Legolas, an elf of Mirkwood’ and he himself never makes much of his noble origins. That's why he doesn't seem important to men, but perhaps he prefers to let his actions speak for themselves and be judged on the basis of his good deeds, rather than on his bloodline Smile

(I think, because of the way he is referred to and after having read all this that he is a younger son, but that’s just my opinion!)

But Gimli is also of noble blood; his father was Gloin, who accompanied Thorin Oakenshield in 'The Hobbit' (and was imprisoned by Thranduil, no doubt a partial reason for the initial bad blood between Legolas and Gimli!) and I think he was also a descendant of Durin the Deathless, which makes him pretty important!

_________________
'Courage, Merry... courage for our friends.'
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Silvae



Joined: 28 Nov 2004
Posts: 99
Location: Lyon, France

PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2005 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanx, that would be very practical! Very Happy
_________________
For what be a wanderer that wandereth not?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
SpaceWeavil



Joined: 27 May 2004
Posts: 23
Location: Looking at shiny things

PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2005 1:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Silvae wrote:
Thanx, that would be very practical! Very Happy


The dictionary thing?

_________________
Pervy Nazgul Fancier and owner of Fluffy the Fell Beast
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum