[Panneth]

I was just wondering what everyone's opinion of who Legolas was. Middle child or heir to the throne? A few hundred years old or a few thousand? Blonde or brunette? (just check out those eyebrows on Movie-Leggy ) There's not much written about who Legolas actually was and it has always bugged me that there were so few details. Any thoughts peeps before I give my humble contribution?

Panneth

[Ellbee]

I haven't read all of Tolkien's work, but I have read just about everything I can get my hands on about Legolas by people who have, and apparently not much is known. We know his father was blond, but no mention is ever made of his appearance. There's a passage where Legolas is looking up at the flying wraith, which says something along the lines of "...the stars framed his dark head..." but I personally have always pictured him blond (even pre-movie) and I always took this to mean that he was simply silhouetted.

As to his age, it's also not given but I have read a very good essay that proposes he's between about 500 to 800 years old, and I'll try to find that. There's no info on any siblings, or his mother, so pretty much anything goes, I'd say. Not very helpful, I know, but there it is.

-Ell

There are a whole series of really interesting and amusing articles on everything from Legolas's background to archery. I believe the author's name is Ellen Brundige: http://www.istad.org/tolkien/


She also references an article by Michael Martinez, which comes to some different conclusions:
http://www.suite101.com/article.cfm/tolkien/36517

Hope these give you some interesting ideas.

[Hathor]

God, this is a question I can ANSWER...

And yet give no real answers.

Firstly, I doubt very much that Legolas is an only child or thathe's the first child. Elves may be immortal, so the issue about being the heir or the spare isn't at play quite as much, but it's still there. Therefore, while the heir or the spare would still be used on, say, military duty and the like, they wouldn't be used as a messenger to Elrond to report that the Elves lost Gollum. And they certainly wouldn't be sent out on a near-death Fellowship quest. There's too much shaky political ground between Elrond and Thranduil for Elrond to pack Thranduil's heir to the throne off on a quest. Therefore, I think that Legolas is probably third or later child. But there's no definite answer...

Age? Hmmmmm. okay, he says in TTT that (excuse my paraphrasing) "500 times have the leaves fallen since the men of Rohan settled, yet that is only a little time to me." He also makes references to "feeling young again" in Fangorn. So, he's older than 500 years. He's also younger than 3000, since he definately wasn't around at the time of the Battle of Dagorlad. So, I place his age at around 1500 years old. But again, there's no definite answer.

Parentage! Aha!

Legolas refers to himself as a wood elf, and of being Sylvan fairly often. Thranduil is, at the very least, half Sindarin. Oropher was full-blooded Sindarin, but we don't know who he married. When he moved into Mirkwood, he may have married a Sylvan bride so as to secure his place, so to speak, but he may already have been married to someone of the Sindarin race. Thranduil in turn may have married a sylvan or a Sindarin. We don't know... but if Legolas refers to himself as Sylvan, we can at least presume he has some Sylvan blood in him, and that he's immersed himself in the cultures of his people. I don't know this for certain, since am pants at languages, but I read somewhere that Legolas' name is very Sylvanised- it's not the normal way you'd write Greenleaf. This lends weight to the idea of Legolas definately having some Sylvan blood in him.

And really, thats all we know.

I wish there was more written about Legolas. I really, really do. But it says in Unfinished Tales that "Legolas achieved least of the Nine Walkers." Legolas was used as a little crossover point for Hobbit readers- "Looky! It's the son of the King from The Hobbit!" That's not saying that he's not an important character, because dayum he is, but... Tolkien didn't consider him important enough to write about.

Of course, all this can be a good thing. After all, this means that we just get a helluva lot of creative license.

God, that was longer than I meant it to be... and don't take any of this as writ. It's just my rambling thoughts, to be honest.

[Thuriniel]

Well, much has been said already about Legolas, but I haven't posted anything in this forum before now, so here we go!

Physically, I imagine Legolas to be blond ... although I must confess that when I first saw a picture of Orlando as Legolas before the release of the movie I was sure he was Glorfindel!

After the reading I've done I would think that Legolas had other sibblings, and that he probably was one of the youngest, since he was sent as a messenger for his father and I don't recall anybody calling him "prince" or "lord" or anything especial during his travels with the Fellowship. As a matter of fact, now that I think about it, he almost sounds like he could be the son of Thranduil and a concubine ... I know, I know, elves mated for life with one partner ... but don't tell me it's not an interesting theory! (that could be backed up as well by the fact that Legolas seems to consider himself Silvan more than Sindarin!).

As for Hathor's comment to Legolas' name being silvanized, I have heard that too. The Sindarin for Greenleaf is Lasgalen ... its sound is like that of Legolas, but with a different twist to it. But then I don't know any Silvan, so I cannot come to definite conclusions about the linguistic background of the name.

And about Legolas being the one of the Nine Walkers that did the least ... well, it only illustrates my suspicions that Tolkien liked Frodo better than Legolas ... but that's OK ... we all have favorites ... and look at all the fun we're having with the son of Thranduil .

So, that was my two cents worth!

Maria

[Panneth]

I've had a thought about Legolas' age. Presuming that he wasn't at the battle of Dagorlad I would say he was about 2500 years old Elves only beget children during times of peace so that would be before the shadow fell on Greenwood for the wood-elves and it became dangerous for them so that would mean Legolas was born before about 1100 TA.

Also as Legolas' name has been Silvanised that would mean he was not born towards the end of the Third Age because the language was no longer spoken by Thranduil and his people. Why would the king name his son in the language his people had forsaken?

What colour hair did the Silvan people? Brown was the dominant *gene* for elves so if Legolas' mother was to be Silvan and they were to have brown hair then he would be a brunette!

Well this has given me something to muse on!

Panneth

Love the pink btw Thuriniel

[Roisin]

Well if anyone was going to have a concubine, Thranduil seemed like the type. He seemed more into the trappings of kingship than the other Elf lords.

I always thought it was a bit unrealistic that none of the various kings and princes in the trilogy had mistresses, but I digress.

As far as people not calling Legolas "lord" or anything, I always figured that Tolkien had his own version of royal protocol.

I always figured that Legolas was an only child b/c his mother fell ill after his birth. As far as how he ended up going along with the Fellowship, I don't think Thranduil had that in mind when he sent him to Rivendell. In fact, I expect he was more than a little put out by it, particularly when the Orcs started knocking on the door.

Roisin

[Roisin]

I've always thought of Legolas as heir to the throne, but now that I think about it.....the "younger son" theory makes sense.

Hmm.

Roisin

[Elentari]

Well...

Hair

The teleri and the sindar were closely related, being divisions of the same bigger, original division of elves. And we do know that teleri tend to have faitr hair (silver... with the eventual blond). Oropher was Sindar, making Thranduil at least half-sindar. We do know that Thranduil was blonde.
Although, the sylvan dominant trait was dark hair and grey eyes. It makes sense to think either Oropher, or Thranduil, or both, would have married a sylvan she-elf.
Legolas might have any of those. About the dark head, I at least interpreted it as Legolas standing against what dim light they had, and being not much more than a shadow to the hobbit in question. In other parts tolkien said 'his fair head'; but then it could also be a trick of the light.
The things we DO know about Legolas are:

Bright eyes
Slender hand (mentioned more than once, whilst no hint at the colour of the hair was given, blast!)
Lithe figure
Tall
Elegant
Fair beyond the measure of men.

About his parentage

No hint as to who the mother or grandmother might have been, althought legolas says he is a wood elf on more than one occasion, plus the name twist thing.

Council of Elrond

Legolas went there with an escort, did he not? To all that we know, he was sent there to give news of their failure in keeping a very important prisoner captive. He had no idea he was going away with the fellowship.
Elrond might have chosen Legolas because he had 'foreseen' the prince of mirkwood would be instrumental.
Althought, Now I think he really should have had a brother or sister. Hmmm...

[Coreinha1980]

Some of this I cannot comment on, but the fact that Legolas might be the son of a concubine is highly unlikely.
Firstly, because Tolkien was a devout Catholic, and would not believe in that sort of thing, and secondly because Elves only mate once, they aren't human, and Tolkien clearly stated human sexual tendancies were 'beneath' elves.

They didn't marry cousins, they only ever had one spouse, and they stopped having sex after their children were born, usually early in life.

There's another interesting fact, for Legolas' age, Elves have children early in life. Usually in their first few hundred years, so it is possible that Legolas is as old as 5000 years.

But, then again, Tolkien preferred to write about the characters that were the exception to the rule, such as Elrond, who's children weren't born until he was 4000 years old (roughly speaking)

I tend to lean toward the fact that he's older, though, roughly the age of Elrond's twin sons, about 3000.

As for hair color, I usually picture him as blonde, though the more I think about it, the more i think he might have had dark hair.

Anyways, I've babbled enough.

XOXO

Cor

[Viv]

Hmm. Well, I've also done a bunch of poking around Tolkien's (published) notes for hints about the elusive Legolas. As you've all pointed out, there just aren't many such hints. I've complied what I found into a chatty essay, "Legolas, Middle-earth Elf of Mystery"

I originally hypothesized that Legolas was rather young (for instance, he isn't mentioned at the Battle of the Five Armies in The Hobbit). But a reader sent me a long note saying that I really should have read the HoME account of the Fall of Gondolin more closely: Legolas was there.

So I reread that passage, followed some other leads, and ammended my essay. Bascially, I'm thinking that our Legolas was the reincarnation of the heroic denizen of Gondolin. Tolkien went on in-depth about how the souls of elves could return with new bodies, after a long and sad stay in the Halls of Mandos.

[sheraiah]

Question for you, Viv, since I have yet to acquire a copy of HoME although I fully intend to when finances permit. Tolkien said that elves COULD return with a new body. Are there specific instances that they did, or was that something that he stated in a letter but never really did much with? I'm asking for a fic that I'm writing and really don't want to make any more canon errors than I already have. Thanks in advance.

[Viv]

Well, apparently there is some real good evidence that he intended Glorfindel of Rivendell to be the reincarnation of Glorfindel of Gondolin (what killed the Balrog... *sighing over heroic first-age evles*). That's the best example. And Legolas, of course.

[sheraiah]

Thank you very much!

[Panneth]

There's something to be said though for Tolkien just reusing names that he'd used in his earlier work that had gone unpublished. I seem to recall from one of the earlier HoME there being an elf called Gimli who most certainly couldn't have been reincarnated as the dwarf in LotR.

It's nice to think that Legolas Greenleaf was the reincarnation of that brave an heroic night-sighted elf from Gondolin *sigh*. I believe that in one of Tolkien's Letters (which I'll admit I haven't read so I'm only going on what I've heard) he said that Glorfindel had left Mandos and returned to ME. I'm not sure whether that was just his soul or his entire being so if anyone has Letters then maybe they could confirm/deny any out of body activities by Glorfindel

Panneth

[Leila]