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Roisin
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 449
Location: U.S.A.
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 Posted: Fri Mar 12, 2004 10:20 pm Post subject: |
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Don't you be hatin' on the Irish, Mora.  I hope to move there some day.
Roisin |
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BittenBuggy
Joined: 27 Dec 2003
Posts: 2108
Location: Busy Being the Queen Of Everything.. And Trying to Catch the Yoda-Copter
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| Posted: Fri Mar 12, 2004 10:23 pm Post subject: |
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I'm still a little grossed out. 
_________________
-The Queen of Everything - so dubed by Aerin
-"My ultimate fantasy is to entice a man to my bedroom, put a gun to his head and say, 'Make babies or die'."
-"The Pope! how many divisions has he got?" - Stalin |
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NancyBrooke
Challenge Admin
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 160
Location: In a motel 6 by the airport
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 3:30 pm Post subject: |
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Dear Jenn:
I am so glad you opened this discussion. I have been searching for just the right way and the right venue to voice my concerns about The Village. I am very glad to know someone else feels similarly and has started discussion about it. Thank you.
I too, am not interested in participating in The Village. From what I understand of it, it's not what I'm looking for in a forum or in fic. Just not my cup of tea, as someone said earlier.
But more importantly, I wonder as you do if The Village is at all appropriate for this site, not for the NC-17 nature of much of its content or how it is eclipsing other discussions on the forum lately, but because it doesn't seem to fit in with the Open Scrolls stated purpose, which is to provide "quality fan fiction in the Lord of the Rings fandom," and "to provide a platform for the authors of Lord of the Rings stories to showcase their work while at the same time providing readers with a collection of high quality stories in a centralized location."
Those stated purposes are why I come to Open Scrolls -- to read good fic, present some fic (good or bad I won't say), discuss fic, discuss Tolkien's works, learn some things.
I don't understand how The Village fits in here.
Anybody like to explain?
PS: I've just seen and read Scribe's well-considered and -written position statement on the front page (thanks, Scribe!). I am glad she has taken up and addressed many of the issues in this this thread, but I'd still like an answer if anyone would care to offer one.
Thx - N
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NB Duchess of WHY TF Cant'chu Punctuate, First Duchess of F*&(ing &*ll yur comma placement sux!
Nazgul #3 in charge of ducking & sniggering
Garo golf a conu ned i eneth aran an ir ho delitha ad |
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Panneth
Joined: 10 Jun 2003
Posts: 0
Location: Manchester/London
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 3:52 pm Post subject: |
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Nancy and Jenn:
I understand your points of view, I really do. I had noticed the forum had been lacking in the non-Village areas and I did try my best to start a topic, but it did not exactly take off. I don't really understand how you can say that the forums have been quiet when you haven't been trying to start threads of your own. If people want to discuss other things then they should start discussions on them.
The girls started the Village threads because there was demand for it and because it was something they wanted to discuss. I do not see anything wrong with that. If the Admins don't have a problem with us being here then what can we do?
I would also like to say that if people are allowed to post AU fics and cross-overs on the site as well as movie fics, then why can't we post our AU simply because you do not like our postings in the forum.
Emma |
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Andreth
Joined: 24 Oct 2003
Posts: 1211
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 4:10 pm Post subject: |
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I'll try to offer an answer, but I'm afraid to say that I am unsure what type of answer you're looking for. If you say you don't enjoy that sort of thing, then you're perfectly within your rights not to like it or not to participate. Even those of us participating in the village have different levels of what we like and what we don't.
But if you want an explanation as to why the village is here, then I would say that's fairly obvious - because there are people who do enjoy it and who are finding it as an enjoyable platform for their writing. I don't see how it violates the stated purpose of Open Scrolls that you quoted in your post. Just because something is of a subject you don't particularly enjoy doesn't make it a poorly written story.
I don't enjoy incest stories, and I see that in a warning and avoid it. But I know there are some well written ones out there. Even I found one story about incest that was well written enough that I overcame my uncomfortableness with the subject to read the story and to think it was a well thought out story. I wouldn't think they had no place here simply because I didn't enjoy them.
The majority of the problem earlier was that the forum was being inundated by posts about the village and making a lot of other members feel left out, and we're all trying to make an effort to correct that. However, that's going to take an effort from everyone, not just those of us who've been participating in the village forums.
As to whether or not the village belongs on the site, I think it does.
I try to help support the site where I can be it financially, with admin duties, beta-ing stories, offering up answers in the forum where I can, and I have to say, as a supporting member, that even if I didn't personally like the village forum or stories, I would still think it belonged here because there were other members who enjoyed it, were working hard to get it started, and trying to be considerate of others in the process.
Other than that, I don't know what else to tell you. That's the only answer I have. |
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NancyBrooke
Challenge Admin
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 160
Location: In a motel 6 by the airport
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Panneth wrote: | Nancy and Jenn:
I don't really understand how you can say that the forums have been quiet ... |
| Panneth wrote: | you do not like our postings in the forum.
Emma |
Did I say either of those things?
_________________
NB Duchess of WHY TF Cant'chu Punctuate, First Duchess of F*&(ing &*ll yur comma placement sux!
Nazgul #3 in charge of ducking & sniggering
Garo golf a conu ned i eneth aran an ir ho delitha ad |
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Panneth
Joined: 10 Jun 2003
Posts: 0
Location: Manchester/London
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 4:25 pm Post subject: |
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I was answering something Jenn mentioned, not just your comment Nancy, with reference to the forums. As for you not liking what we posted, I had just assumed that as you didn't want to post there and were against it, that you didn't like it. I apologise if I've assumed wrongly.
Em |
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NancyBrooke
Challenge Admin
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 160
Location: In a motel 6 by the airport
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Panneth wrote: | | I had just assumed that as you didn't want to post there and were against it ... |
Did I say I was against it?
_________________
NB Duchess of WHY TF Cant'chu Punctuate, First Duchess of F*&(ing &*ll yur comma placement sux!
Nazgul #3 in charge of ducking & sniggering
Garo golf a conu ned i eneth aran an ir ho delitha ad |
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Panneth
Joined: 10 Jun 2003
Posts: 0
Location: Manchester/London
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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Then your criticism is only that you think it doesn't belong here? My only reply to that is that as Scribe and Do seem happy for it to continue, then I don't see the problem.
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~ Emma |
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NancyBrooke
Challenge Admin
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 160
Location: In a motel 6 by the airport
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 4:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Andreth wrote: | | But if you want an explanation as to why the village is here, then I would say that's fairly obvious - because there are people who do enjoy it and who are finding it as an enjoyable platform for their writing. |
Thanks, that's a great answer. Now I understand it a little better; Thank you.
I have trouble with RPG fic or even pseudo-RPG fic, but as I see there's a lot of fic pouring out of The Village then Bully for you! More fic is good fic.
| Andreth wrote: | | Just because something is of a subject you don't particularly enjoy doesn't make it a poorly written story. |
Again, did I say that?
Lordy, it is amazing how many ways someone can be misunderstood in one post, and I even tried so hard to be straightforward and impersonal.
I heartily agree with you -- there's plenty of good fic out there written on subjects I don't care to read about, and lots of poor fic written on subjects dear to my heart (possibly even by yours truly); you're right, subject matter and quality of expression have absolutely nothing to do with one another, but as I think we have strayed far enough of the subject now I'll move on.
_________________
NB Duchess of WHY TF Cant'chu Punctuate, First Duchess of F*&(ing &*ll yur comma placement sux!
Nazgul #3 in charge of ducking & sniggering
Garo golf a conu ned i eneth aran an ir ho delitha ad |
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NancyBrooke
Challenge Admin
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 160
Location: In a motel 6 by the airport
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Panneth wrote: | | Then your criticism is only that you think it doesn't belong here? |
Oh, for heaven's sake! I said I didn't understand how it fit in here, not that it didn't fit in here. How is that a criticism?
_________________
NB Duchess of WHY TF Cant'chu Punctuate, First Duchess of F*&(ing &*ll yur comma placement sux!
Nazgul #3 in charge of ducking & sniggering
Garo golf a conu ned i eneth aran an ir ho delitha ad |
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BittenBuggy
Joined: 27 Dec 2003
Posts: 2108
Location: Busy Being the Queen Of Everything.. And Trying to Catch the Yoda-Copter
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 4:50 pm Post subject: |
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| NancyBrooke wrote: |
But more importantly, I wonder as you do if The Village is at all appropriate for this site, not for the NC-17 nature of much of its content or how it is eclipsing other discussions on the forum lately, but because it doesn't seem to fit in with the Open Scrolls stated purpose, which is to provide "quality fan fiction in the Lord of the Rings fandom," and "to provide a platform for the authors of Lord of the Rings stories to showcase their work while at the same time providing readers with a collection of high quality stories in a centralized location."
Those stated purposes are why I come to Open Scrolls -- to read good fic, present some fic (good or bad I won't say), discuss fic, discuss Tolkien's works, learn some things.
I don't understand how The Village fits in here.
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Here is a copy of Scribes rules for this site:
1. All fan fiction here is based on the characters and situations described in the Lord of the Rings trilogy (books and/or movies), the Silmarillion and the other works related to Middle-earth.
2. As this is a het archive, obviously no slash is permitted.
Stories not involving partnerships (i.e. neither 'het' nor 'slash') are welcomed. It is just the slash we prefer to keep elsewhere.
3. All pairings are permitted, no matter how odd, as long as they are male/female.
If your stories contain elements that some readers might find offensive, please issue WARNINGS. See below for further guidelines about these.
There will be NO
-Real People Fanfics (RPFs, RPSs) - The actors of the films have no relation to Tolkien therefore no place on this archive
-Mystery Science Theatre (MSTs) - I do not feel these stories are conducive to the spirit of this archive. Since they are comments using someone else's hard work - good or bad, I would prefer that they be not archived here.
-Chat Room Fanfics - These aren't stories with a clear narrative and are better suited for archiving at Fan Fiction Net.
-Lists/Bloopers - Same reason as above - more substance would be required.
-Game Show Fanfics - Because Wheel of Fortune has no place in Middle-earth and Jeopardy is a way of life (ask any hobbit).
-Song Parodies - This is a story archive, not MTV. And we all skipped over those songs Bombadil sang anyway *g*. Seriously, if you have an original poem, we have a special area called 'Bombadil's Corner' where these are more than welcome.
-MPREG (being male pregnancy) - I don't think Tolkien really had this in mind for Legolas.
Now, Nancy and Jenn, if you can point out to me where exactly we have broken a rule, to make it 'not fit into this site' then I may reasses my standing. But I can see absolutly nothing wrong with what has been written so far, or what will be written in the future. I know that Sind and Mora and I are trying to keep a very tight leash on what belongs and what doesn't.
We want the site's name to stay as upstanding as you do. This is just a place for people to fellowship and have fun. And that's what it is... fun. If it isn't your cup of tea, I will be more than happy to talk to you on other forums. But I just didn't see either of you starting one or participating in others.
_________________
-The Queen of Everything - so dubed by Aerin
-"My ultimate fantasy is to entice a man to my bedroom, put a gun to his head and say, 'Make babies or die'."
-"The Pope! how many divisions has he got?" - Stalin |
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Panneth
Joined: 10 Jun 2003
Posts: 0
Location: Manchester/London
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 4:53 pm Post subject: |
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Sorry Nancy, I think we've both had our wires crossed. The Village is here because people are enjoying and contributing. If it gets people writing then I think it's a good thing.
As for how it fits into the OSA framework, I have no idea how it going to evolve, but I think that keeping it separate from the main archive is probably wise. We've already agreed to no slash whatsoever because of the link back to OSA, and that includes on the little site Mora has put together for us. As for the rest of it - I'm only along for the ride, I'm definitely not driving! Though I must agree with BB, that the moderators are among he most active members of the threads on the whole and if anyone is going to keep a good eye on things it's them.
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~ Emma |
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NancyBrooke
Challenge Admin
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 160
Location: In a motel 6 by the airport
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 5:10 pm Post subject: |
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Ok, now I'm really confused ...
I tried very carefully in my post not to condemn, disparage, disapprove, or even disagree with The Village activities on this site. I said merely that I was not interested in it and didn't really understand it, and asked how it fit into the stated goals of Open Scrolls. Thanks go to Andreth again for answering me on that last point (Thank you, again, Andreth).
Subsequently, I have been criticized for critizing, for impuning the quality of Village fic, and for not being visible starting forum topics or participating in forum topics -- all accusations completely without merit.
I certainly hope you don't read the stories posted on this site with such prejudice and carelessness.
~N
ps: Thanks, Em, for your apology; I really appreciate it. I will agree with you "that if it gets people writing it's a good thing."
_________________
NB Duchess of WHY TF Cant'chu Punctuate, First Duchess of F*&(ing &*ll yur comma placement sux!
Nazgul #3 in charge of ducking & sniggering
Garo golf a conu ned i eneth aran an ir ho delitha ad
Last edited by NancyBrooke on Sat Mar 13, 2004 5:13 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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JennnLee
Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 123
Location: Orlando, FL
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| Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Now, Nancy and Jenn, if you can point out to me where exactly we have broken a rule, to make it 'not fit into this site' then I may reasses my standing. But I can see absolutly nothing wrong with what has been written so far, or what will be written in the future. I know that Sind and Mora and I are trying to keep a very tight leash on what belongs and what doesn't.
We want the site's name to stay as upstanding as you do. This is just a place for people to fellowship and have fun. And that's what it is... fun. If it isn't your cup of tea, I will be more than happy to talk to you on other forums. But I just didn't see either of you starting one or participating in others.
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Wow, that's odd, since I've been participating in these forums since pretty much the day they began. Strange that you haven't seen me before. No, I don't start a lot of topics because in all honesty I don't know a lot about LOTR than the movies, since I still haven't made it all the way through the books. But I've read a lot of discussions and learned a lot, even when I haven't posted.
I think Nancy's concern was whether an RPG, which seems to me to be what this Village thing is, and all the stories that evolve from that, belonged or should be given equal billing as the general story archive on this site. It's certainly an ambitious project, and like I said before I don't think anyone's trying to take it away from you. But when it's all I see as the "active" part of the site, I'm going to tend to drift away, and I'm sure others are too. I'm sure that doesn't concern you one iota, but there it is.
And yes, you are right, I don't see that you've broken any "rule," and I don't think anyone accused you of that either. But I would personally like to see the Village stories not mixed in with the generally archived stories. As I said, it creates a different kind of first impression. If I clicked onto this site for the first time yesterday looking for some good Lord of the Rings fanfiction, clicked onto "All Stories" and saw all the stories with bondage and BDSM warnings as the most recent offerings, I would hit the back button and never come back. And that's certainly not going to help the site stay "upstanding," IMHO.
I contribute financially to this site too. And I know that doesn't give me any rights to say what goes on, but in all honesty I will rethink contributing if this is going to be the primary focus of the site.
But ultimately you're right, it's up to Scribe and Do. And if they like it this way, that's fine. |
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