[VanatheEverYoung]

I'm wondering if anybody knows how M-E constellations translate into modern constellations. I see in the Index of Silmarillion that the Valacirca is the Great Bear. (And if anyone knows what the hell that is, please tell me that also). But, I read on Council of Elrond that the Valacirca is the Big Dipper. So, is there a discrepency somewhere in HoME or Letters or some other books I haven't read yet? Some other constellations I can guess; Menelmacar's belt=Orion's belt, and I read somewhere that Earendil is Venus. I just really need to know about the Sickle of the Valar.

My fic is an AU "modern day" story. The Elves are star gazing, and it would be really embarassing to have an Elf incorrectly name the most important constellation in the sky and incorrectly point to its location. Or rather, it would be embarassing for a certain fanfic writer .

[Eruanna]

[quote="VanatheEverYoung"]I'm wondering if anybody knows how M-E constellations translate into modern constellations. I see in the Index of Silmarillion that the Valacirca is the Great Bear. (And if anyone knows what the hell that is, please tell me that also). But, I read on Council of Elrond that the Valacirca is the Big Dipper. So, is there a discrepency somewhere in HoME or Letters or some other books I haven't read yet? Some other constellations I can guess; Menelmacar's belt=Orion's belt, and I read somewhere that Earendil is Venus. I just really need to know about the Sickle of the Valar.

[/quote]

I somewhere read an astromony site that had astral analyses of Tolkien's writing. Have you Googled the'net for information?

I think this must be the Big Dipper??? (It is scoop shaped.)

I am sure the info has to be out there. They are, after all, the People of the Stars.

--Eruanna

[sindohte]

The Valacirca is known as the Sickle of the Valar which is comparable to the modern day constellation of the Great Bear, Ursa Major.

[Eruanna]

[quote="sindohte"]The Valacirca is known as the Sickle of the Valar which is comparable to the modern day constellation of the Great Bear, Ursa Major.[/quote]

Sindhote:

Thanks for the correction. The tail is like a sickle. Yup, a long-tailed bear!

--Eruanna

[sindohte]

Hmmm, I am confused now. The Silm says one thing, but a check of a webpage by a physics/astronomy professor says something entirely different. http://www.physics.ccsu.edu/larsen/jrrt.html Because according to this professor, the Valacirca is the Big Dipper. Errghhh. Time for more research.

[Alassante]

[sindohte]

Ahh okay, mystery is solved.

The constellation Ursa Major contains the group of stars commonly called the Big Dipper. The handle of the Dipper is the Great Bear's tail and the Dipper's cup is the Bear's flank. The Big Dipper is not a constellation itself, but an asterism, which is a distinctive group of stars. Another famous asterism is the Little Dipper in the constellation Ursa Minor.

I found the information here -
http://www.astro.wisc.edu/~dolan/constellations/constellations/Ursa_Major.html

[VanatheEverYoung]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but ... The Big Dipper, Ursa Major, and the Great Bear are all the same constellation. (I spontaneously remembered from from Astronomy. Amazing!) So, it looks like I'm on the right track. Thanks! But, if you find any updates, be sure to let me know .

[VanatheEverYoung]

Looks like we had lightbulbs go off at the same time, Sind! So now I can post my chapter! Thanks!

[sindohte]

[SpaceWeavil]

Don't know if this is of any use to you, Vana, but I did a bit of research on astronomical stuff in ME for 'And in the Darkness', for the Witch King's alchemy / astrology hobby, and so I've got the names of the major planets in Quenya.

Like I said, don't know if it's useful or not, but I'll stick it on here, since I had the list made up anyway.

Mars - Carnil
Mercury - Elemmírë
Jupiter - Alcarinquë
Venus - Eärendil or I also found Tancol
Saturn - Lumbar

[NancyBrooke]

http://valarguild.org/varda/Tolkien/encyc/stars.html#Stars.

This is the site I used for info when writing "Weapons Against the Enemy." It lists the stars mentioned in LOTR and the Silm, their ME constellation etc., then our modern equivalent. Can't say if it's very accurate or comprehensive but it was interesting.

[SpaceWeavil]

[Alassante]